Hogan Brown and Patrick Mackenzie

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Alright. Hey, everyone. Welcome back.

My name Hogan Brown. This is the Barb podcast, And if you listen to the last episode with the Captain Lucas Best set. We we talked about a naming contest. We're gonna be running, and, we're we're still working on that. So stay tuned to that.

But today, we're back in. It's

later in the week of the first first real full week of July. It's gonna get hot here again in Northern California, but

still a lot of fishing going on, a lot of stuff to do. So

without any further ado, I wanna welcome my guest today,

mister Patrick Mackenzie.

And

to give you... All the listeners kinda some context is, I

me and Patrick, I I I guess we know each other, but not really well. Right?

Yeah.

I... Think the first time that we met Hogan was

it was probably

four or five years ago, and it was at Pleasant. Yeah. Right. That's what I was gonna say. Absolutely. Because I I remember. I was wandering around with a buddy of mine, and I saw you and chuck

working the cash open. Yeah. Yes. This is exactly my memory as well. Yeah. Yeah. Then I came over. It was cool because I got to me... I got to me meet both of you guys and kinda one fail swoop. And

no. It was cool. And then the funny thing was is I was like,

when you're were talking about Cast hope and

and I asked you Was like, hey, You know, if you ever need...

You ever need and, you know, another captain or something to to help out on the trips, and you're were like, dude, get on the list. You've got everyone trying to help out. Yeah. Yeah. On the cast stuff, which was so cool because

it's just great that

everyone, all the guides and all the captains are supporting that. I think it's really Yeah cool what you guys do. Yeah. Well, we appreciate that. And and indefinitely, whenever you whenever you do something

kinda outside the box like, cast open, people actually wanna help out. That's always a good sign and somewhat humbling, but that's... I'm glad you remember that because I remember that.

That's probably the only time I think we've met in person, but that was... That was four or five years ago and And I remember it because wanna you came up. You introduced yourself. You said, hey I'm gonna I'm gonna guide

out of the Napa area,

and you rattled off places like, I didn't even know where they were.

And

you me it hard. Like you're like, I got my Captain license. I got a ranger boat, and I'm like,

oh my god. Who is this? Like, this is okay Balls move. You know, like, right on. And yeah.

I was like, well, I never... I'm... I may never see this get getting maybe homeless because just spent and wasted all this money or

some really cool stuff gonna come out of this. So...

Yeah. Totally. Totally. It was, like, it was one of those things where I was like.

Man. They're, like,

like, H Brown and chuck and they're both there. So, you know, this is, like, this, like, my first... This is, like, my first year at Pleasant, you know, after I gotten and set up, and I was ready to go. And I was like, alright. This is...

You gotta do this. This is either the the these are the two people if anyone in the field that you got it. So... Yeah. That's... Well, thank you. That... That's humbling and and hopefully, you you don't... Hopefully, I seem a little more blue collar and down earth than maybe you had made me out to be. But

Oh, no. You guys were so cool and it was just... Like I said, it was just awesome to see

what you guys were doing over at

Cash hope open and just all the support you guys get, I think it's a really special thing again. Cool No. Not a lot of not a lot of states outside of California doing stuff like that. So

we're pretty

we're pretty progressive, I think in that.

Yeah. You know. People are catching on, and it's one of those things with Cast. Like, I... You know, when we talk about what we do and we... You know, and and for the listeners that don't know, I I I...

Me and a partner,

a friend of mine for

god, I don't know how long. Ryan Johnston work and

Ryan's our director at Cast. But, basically, the...

Short of it as we get kids outdoors via the sport of fly fishing because

Lord knows kids need to get off screens and don't have the opportunities that many of us had to get outdoors. So,

we do that through offering.

All sorts of experiences, but a lot of it is free fly fishing trips. So... Yeah.

So I I I think states to catching on, but,

you know, I I don't know. I... It's kinda one of those things should put your head down and you do what you do. And if people get it, They get it and if not, then

you know, they're just not gonna be part of the solution, I guess. So... Yeah. So.

So it it was it was cool last year,

just

one one last thing I For I take trouble, man. Plenty of time.

I had

I had helped Joshua Schwartz last year. We did a dinner

for Ryan. I somehow how... It was a cast dinner at someone's house outside of Chico. And it was often it was really cool. Everyone that showed up.

Was great and and Ryan's great. And... Yeah. That's the we really enjoyed it. Yeah. So schwartz, and

we always basically

sell off schwartz talents as a cook. So right it's just a huge supporter of Cast open. I mean,

Yeah. It the skill set that he brings and the value that it adds to the organization's huge. I mean, the guy's a world class

chef.

Along with be being a really good human being. So

Yeah. Yeah. All the above. Yeah. He's a special

special dude. Yeah schwartz this. So so really, the reason I I I... And, again, one of the things that

I guess...

I've been doing this a long time I've been around a long time and by no means does that make me better than anyone else. But one thing that I've always

respected is I've come up and kinda pride my own self in is

innovating and doing things differently. You know, there's a lot of paths.

In the fly fishing industry, especially in the guiding world that are kind of the

the beaten path or the, you know, the paved road to success, you know? And Sure. Sure. Around here, that's, you know, you you you learn out a road drift boat. You had a drift boat,

you know, you learn how to low row the lower Sack. You learn the Hub, the American, you know, if you're down in the bay. You learn the delta,

maybe some Creek, American River,

and you you kinda follow that path and maybe maybe after a few years, You know, you build that clientele, and you you can kinda divert off and maybe do a little bit different. I mean, that's by far how I've... How I ran my path. But

Yeah. The one thing that stuck out to me with that first day you handed me, this business card was literally, I didn't know where any of the places you were gonna guide were on a map. So

yeah. Talk to us about how that... I mean, I was looking kinda doing some research online, and, you know, you're obviously... It says you're born and raised in Sonoma and stuff. And but how

tell a little bit, tell the people where you guide. First of all, and then kinda how

how you got started and said this is what I'm gonna do.

Yeah. Well,

so I run my guide service is called Mackenzie Fly, and

I primarily

do

stripe.

In

little bit in San Francisco Bay,

and primarily,

Napa River.

So

between

downtown Napa

in San Francisco.

There's probably...

I don't know.

Thirty five miles

that

you know, that's all fish water.

And that is

that's really my primary focus, but the last couple of years,

Ryan Williams

has really...

He really opened my eyes to the possibility

of

of doing the lake, you know, and we were having conversation. We were having conversations. He's opened everybody's eyes. Like, I mean, totally dude I mean, if there is an innovator in lake fishing for bass. Ryan. I mean, ryan Williams opened my eyes to it. So... Yeah.

Dude. And

he,

you know,

he showed me...

He showed me the float and fly thing. And

for the most part,

I'm really not a barber guy.

I I have a hard... I have a hard time staring if fa. Yeah unless we're still had fishing.

That's that's kind of like my

only exception, but I went out with Ryan once, and I saw...

I saw the master at work. And I'm like, totally. This is a this is a... This is a legitimate thing. Yeah.

I had a very similar experience, man. Like, I'd I'd... I was like, barber for Bass. Like, no. That's not I'm not doing that. Like, you know, that's kiss your sister. Yeah. I just don't do that.

Did you have, like, an aha moment, like I did with Ryan where... Well, like... I would doesn't even like, I was really friends with Ryan, and I always supported Ryan and everything he did, but it was, like, one of those things where I was like, I just can't get behind that, ryan. I'm sorry. Like, I'm just, like, I'm not doing that. Right? And then Right.

It was...

It was a couple years ago was a big winner. And Chuck was way into it. Chuck was into it based on

his kinda background in the south and the Alabama, Tennessee, Texas, Florida. Like, he he knew about... Sure.

And

I remember it's, like, I was sitting home

and everything's blown out, like, I'm not doing anything in chuck like, going out to Or, you know, which is literally thirty minutes from my house and just

fish every day. Right. Yeah. Like,

Okay. I'll go. I'll try this and, like, so I right. I did it with him one day I was freezing asshole cold,

and I just was like, oh. This is this is not what I thought.

Like this is... Yeah. This really cool.

So... Yeah. I had the aha moment just like you, man.

Yeah. And it's, like, you know, everything

everything in my head was telling me like, look. You're not gonna like this. This is not... This isn't your speed. And then once I did it,

it was... It was a total game changer. And so that basically,

you know, around our short keys that we have,

on the napa. Yeah.

That

that lake thing has really opened up the rest of the year for me. And

you know, it allows me

allows me to... We've... I've got... I live in Sonoma. So

within an hour's drive away from me, I have four lakes

the bay

and the delta. So that's a lot of water, you know, in in my general area.

And

for

you know, until until two or three years ago, was just it was all stripe all the time. And I was just kind of, you know, moving from the bay to the river to the delta in the team

just kinda chasing him around because that's that's really where my passion is. But,

I'll tell you the the past couple years doing doing the barber thing on the lakes. I I really enjoy it. And

it's it's a good thing because

it wow

Anglers

who are new to the sport.

To get out and experience it, you know, and I can't I can't necessarily say that about stripe fishing. Oh, I I would agree a hundred percent. You know, we always talk about stripe fishing on the rivers me and chuck and stuff, and it's like, there's probably no other guiding that that I've done that your success rate is so dependent on the skill set of the angle. You know what I mean? Right. Right. You gotta be able to fish.

Totally. Hey totally. And you have to be you have to be on the same page. You know, it's more... It's really a team you're working as a team, and and a lot of people don't understand that. And

so so the lake is just,

you know, the lake for me,

it's so enjoyable

because you can... Like, I can kind of relax as as the guy, you know, and focus on teaching and being a part of their experience

and,

you know, catching and fish, really is is, you know, what we're doing. And and,

I've just really enjoyed it, and I think my clients up too. Yeah. No. It it definitely offers

for,

you know, a stripe guide

that opportunity to kinda of bring clients up in the sport. You know, I know... No totally. You know, fifteen years ago when I was just guiding trout. It was like,

I couldn't just take a newbie out on the U and dump them in a flat during the Pm hatch and be like, okay. We're gonna learn to cast this, you know, thirteen thirty six x. Like, hopefully you have fun. Yeah. You know, was, like, we had to be like, okay. Well, we're gonna go walk and raid with the three weights, and then, you know, then we're getting in the drift boat next time and go on the lower Sack. And, you know, you kinda walk them through the sport into these,

you know, Right new experiences and kinda up their their skill set and, like, being stripe guides. It's like,

it was one of the toughest parts when I made that switch in my business and my my guiding to just guiding for stripe and Bass was like, I just really thin

the funnel on the people that can actually do this. This is the pinnacle of, like, big game fishing in Northern California is chasing the stripe and having that I would agree. I mean, you said it more eloquently than I did. Like, having that lake

option

allows

us to stay in the motor boat and,

you know, offer something to people

that

is easy. I mean, bottom line. It's not hard fishing. And and you know, it's

you probably experienced the same thing with me as you have client. I had a client just the other day, that I was like, hey I wanna get my grandson out. And it's like, well, perfect. I got the option. You know, you just have... Yes. Totally. Whereas is you're like, well, maybe we could get him on a spinning rod for some stripe? We could... You know what I mean? Like, you kinda start scratching because you want...

You wanna help the guy out, and you wanna get your clients

kid or wife or somebody out. But

what we do in the boat for the stripe is just... It's... There's no way around the fact it's not for beginners. You know, Right. Right. And, you know, a lot of time... A lot of times that's a hard conversation to have with people.

Absolutely. And and and, you know, peep certain people react

differently to it, but

you know, I think it's one thing that I've learned,

which

which I just kinda had an epiphany about probably, like a year ago is really having that conversation as far as it is with people Yeah. If, you know, because if you don't know where they're at

as far as their skill set, and

you know, they get in the boat,

it... It's really...

It's good for everyone involved to just have the conversation ahead of time.

So you don't... You don't get into a situation where someone might feel uncomfortable

or there's... You know, because it's demanding. You know, what we do...

It... We don't... I I don't think we really think about it all that much Hogan because we're assuming it all the time. Yeah. So When you're when you're when you strike for fish as much as we do, it's just...

That's fish. It's been that's fishing, dude. And I'm like, I don't, you know, like, it's funny because, like, when I'll go... When I go trout,

or do anything else. It's, like, that's that's so difficult for me. Right? Because I never do it. You know, I like, I've trout, like, three times a year, man and I'm one of the worst trout fishermen in California guarantee it. I'm getting ready job too. I'm not gonna lie.

And it's like... And it's like, man. Like, I really need start branching out, but like that's

you know,

going back. That's something that...

Being realistic about

expectations and what the client

is expecting out the trip is especially where I'm at because it can be

very very finicky,

Yeah. And it's it's it's... I mean, it's almost, like a, like, a coastal coastal stream situation where there's windows. You know, you have you have these weeks that are where there are windows.

And in between that,

you really have to get

creative.

You know, If you're gonna... If you're going put put some fish in the boat. So, you know, I know, at this point, I have clients that are that are up to speed and they know the drill and Yeah. All that, But, you know, as far as, you know, bringing new people on. It's a always something I... I like to have an honest conversation with people because

well, no. You're just you're you're saying... That's the nature. Yeah. You're saying win. Go go for it.

I just saying, you know, that's that's the nature of stripe mission. And more than anything,

man, like, I just want people to have fun and hopefully learn something. And

you know, whether

stripe fishing for them,

that's awesome because it's for me too. I know it's for me. It's my favorite thing to do. But

if they don't have the skill set then I always

always

like to recommend the lakes because

it's just for for

ninety percent of the people, it's just so much more enjoyable.

Yeah. That's a good point. And I... I was gonna see, you know, a lot of the... I I've... Been fortunate enough to talk and come up with a lot of great guides. And it's managing

expectations is huge. No matter if you're a salt guide in Florida or or t guide in California or Stripe guide. It's

you know, managing people's

expectations based on their skill set is That's one of the the most important things about being a good guide, you know? So... Right. Right. So how... And this is real... How did you grown up in Sonoma

decide because I mean, my first thought is if I'm living in Sonoma, I'm probably guiding Pun Creek. Like that is. Like, I mean, not because I want to. Let's be... I'm I'm... So Yeah. I'll be very clear with you. Like, I've never fished food of Creek. And,

I don't have anything against Food Creek. I just

I don't wanna... Like,

I think of it as the closest trout fishing to the bay area. And

which it is? Which it is. And and it's... And it's wild fish from what I understand, what I've... What I've been told. It's wild trout. Yeah. And it... I mean, it sounds incredibly technical. It sounds super cool, but it's almost like,

I just... I've never done it. I don't know why I I... You know, Ryan my partner in Cast openly Went to Davis. He talked about fish fishing it and guiding it. And I knew Toby when Toby owned owned his shop down there, Toby up in house, He fished at a ton and promoted it at a ton And...

Oh, yeah. Yeah. You know, so, like,

how did you be, like, I am not guiding P Creek, and I live in.

But, well,

well, you know, it's kind of like,

it, you know, it's kind of like, at some point, you have to draw a line

just like how we were talking about with with with the Bob thing on the lakes. Yeah. And I

it... You know, growing up, we...

I'm fifteen minutes from my launch. Alright. So

in fifteen minutes pulling out of my gate,

I can be dropping in the water

in the Napa River. So,

you know, growing up, we were...

We did a lot of fishing, a lot of, like, saltwater bait fishing. Right? For stripe, for sturgeon,

and because it was fifteen minutes from our house.

And,

you know, making the trek

an hour an hour and fifteen minutes up to Barr

that pew area, Yeah. Was just... It was just always too long because we know we could go fifteen minutes.

Even if we didn't catch anything, we're still fishing. You know, at that point, we were all just we were doing bait, and Yeah. You know, we were we were throwing paddle tails and rattle traps. And We did some trolling and stuff like that, but it looks.

Basically just bait fishing, you know, bait fishing for rays for sturgeon and, all that stuff. So...

So did... Did your dad take you out there? Is that when you say we, Is that your your fit... Your your dad taking you out fishing?

No. No. Interestingly enough, my dad,

my dad was a hunter. So okay. So growing up, you know, I was never

I was never allowed

really to go on those...

Hunting trips. Yeah. That I really had... Not that I've really had any interest in it anyways, but The dad's vacation.

And, yeah. You know, like, he would go, you know, he'd go off to Humble and, you know, they'd hunt for pigs, and then, you know, he'd go out to sack and

he really luck up birds, you know, foul and fed and stuff like that. But,

you know, so he's going his hunting trips and stuff like that, and then,

you know, I always help him get ready. I always... I have these memories of, you know, being in the garage. When he's packing up all this stuff and cleaning his shotgun and stuff like that. And then, you know, I wouldn't seem for three or four days, and then he'd come back and have...

Whatever he got on the trip, and then, you know, I'd watch them clean it and help them clean up his guns and all that stuff. Like, I enjoyed it. I enjoyed that part, you know, spending time with my dad. But... Yeah.

I think especially at that age. It didn't really

killing things didn't really interest me. And it still doesn't. You know, I, like,

I really...

That's kind of like a sensitive subject for me because, you know, in this day and age if I have if I have money to go out and buy food, I'm generally not gonna kill anything myself month. Yeah. It's definitely a touchy touchy subject to among own people and and it is one that...

I mean, I... I've hunted and

I've,

you know, my kids are familiar with the killing of animals and where their food comes from and all that. But Right. I... As someone who kinda walks in the middle on a lot of things. I completely understand both sides of the argument. So Yeah. Yeah. Totally. And I've got I've got a lot of friends that that hunt, you know, conventional in with bose and stuff like that. And I totally get it. I think it's,

I think it's really cool,

especially the guys that...

That really have a passion for it and and and do it right. You know.

There's a lot of people doing

doing it the right way and a lot of people doing it

their own way. So that's a good one... That's a that's a good way to say it.

Yeah. Yeah. So you're don't... So your doctor didn't fish.

Basically.

Well, well, you know, like, he would. I remember... I remember I asked Was like, dad. Let's go fishing, and then he shut up

He set up a trip with, like, some of his friends. Right? It was, like a, like, a boys camping. Yeah. Yeah. Machine trip. And I think we went to S

well to some lake. We went to some Lake and we trolled for, trout.

Perfect.

And that was so fun. I mean, I I still remember, you know, sitting sitting in the boat watching the rods and we caught a bunch of trout. Yeah. For that weekend. And and I just loved it. And That's awesome.

You know, more than anything that was being on the water, You know, if my dad and his buddies, and it was it was just... It was a fun trip. That was kind of my first

my first real memory of, you know, probably going on a legitimate fishing trip. Yeah. So...

And then, you know, fast forward a little bit when I was twelve, my dad got a job in Cleveland. So

up yeah. So we up and moved...

And we were in Cleveland

for seven years, maybe eight years. Oh, wow.

And so during that time,

the first the first house that we moved to when we got to Cleveland, we were renting this house.

It was on a private lake.

So so back behind the house, there was literally a dock, which was next to this big dam,

and

I just started fishing the lake. We... There was a family next to us. They had three boys, and they were really good fishermen because they were... You know, they grew up there on that lake.

So we'd go out on Canoe. There was there was, like some, like,

paddle boat

situations that at a neighbor's dock that that we'd, like, common dear the paddle boat Orders like the lake pirates dude. Like you're finding anything that floats.

Dude dude we knew we knew most of those fish by name and at that point you're, like, you know, you got four guys fishing off the paddle boat. Like, it's kinda like,

it's like, You're gonna figure it out.

Oh, dude. Dude. We dude. We we were, like, we were into all that stuff. Like, all the, like,

we go through, you know,

bags just sent goes in a day.

We, you know, we... Do we go out? We do, like, we're just into this top water today. Yeah. We're we're really into it. You know? So

so I kinda had that,

that experience in high school, and then I kinda got into sports once I eighth eighth grade, ninth grade got into sports

and pretty much played sports the rest of high school fish a little bit, you know. But Yeah. Yeah. Focused focused mainly on sports

less less so on my school work, but I was. That's that's a fairly... That's a fairly common

common male experience. It's like, I was. I was dude. I always tell people like, you know,

I fished until girls started to think that playing sports was cool, and then I was all over sports because girls were not impressed with my fly fishing skills.

Right. Right. And it was, like, and out there, you know, it's a totally

totally different mindset out there, but,

sports play a huge role,

you know, with Ohio state there. Oh, Yeah. It's just...

It's...

Sports are huge in Ohio. And the and the schools are really good too, but,

I was pretty pretty involved in the sports programs and not kind of

made up for my shortcomings in the classroom. If you know what I mean? I do. I like like, like, a a a a fair amount of what happened was overlooked because of my involvement in the athletics program. So

yeah. So that was great.

And, you know,

what's interesting is we lived the last house we learned in before it moved back

backed up to the Sugar and River, which I didn't know

until I moved back and read and live

fishing magazine that it has one of the best

Midwest steel head runs

in, like, a area of, like, three states sugar in River.

You know, my... The only reason I know that river is one of my dear friends that I used to

work out here was from Ohio, and he moved back to Akron, Ohio. And,

I mean, the Midwest is probably one of the most under fished,

like, destination fisheries work that I can think of. I mean, the the amount of back there is just insane.

You know, Yeah. Pretty The level of, you know,

if if you're... If you go steel head fishing out in the Midwest. And, yes, they run out of the Great lakes, They're, you know, not saltwater fish, but they're their steel head.

Totally you're you're ruined. You're never going for stealing fish in California

can't. Like, you're yeah. It's like going trout fishing in Alaska and then being like, hey. So you guys wanna go out and, you know, catch, like, a trout.

Yeah. So... Yeah. Totally. So, you know, it it was it was a good thing because back then, I didn't really have time to be a steel junkie, and

it just it wouldn't have fit in my schedule. I don't think. I don't know.

But so that was

that was pretty

pretty interesting knowing that there was a bunch of steel head hanging out in my backyard and I didn't even really.

Go go play with him. But... Yeah.

That's that's water under the bridge. And then, when I moved back,

moved back right after our graduated away from high school. I,

I went to culinary school here in Saint. Helena at the Cia.

Oh, okay. And then,

yeah. So you know, so that's kinda how I know Joshua. That's the schwartz connection. Yeah. Right. Right. So so after I graduated from culinary school, I've worked in...

I worked in

the Valley Napa Valley here.

For Thomas Keller. And so I met

Joshua,

you know, like you start... You spend so much time in kitchens. Right? You start talking with people and I'm like, what are you into? You're like, bought fish

you know, and I'm not here. I'm pretty much. Like, Yeah. You know Schwartz.

I'm like, no. I keep hearing this name Schwartz, And then, you know, we finally connected, and then

you know, we've been friends ever since, but that's that's that's where our friendship is rooted, and

Gotcha. Yeah. You guys connect on all levels, man. I mean Yeah. Yeah. That's why it's really cool because, like, when Joshua does

dinner?

Yeah. For

events or whatever it is,

you know, anything fishing related. It's like, it's a good it's a good in for me to a, give them a hand. Yeah. But also b b for me to be there.

You know, because the stuff that he chooses to be a part of is always really cool. Yeah. And

I think that

it's just

it's it's been a really cool relationship and and I consider him

a huge mentor and

just someone who's greatly influenced me. And

In a good way. You know, there's there's people

in life that, you know,

send you in certain directions. And

you know, I... He was one of the first people that I came to when I had this idea starting my business. Gotcha. I was actually... I was actually working for him. That I was between jobs and I was working for him at the winery. U. And I was like... I was like, chef. When he run something by you really quick. And he needed he needed help at the winery at the time he was short staffed he was looking for people and... Yeah. I was like, I was like I got this idea.

I wanna... I I wanna start guiding the napa River for stripe,

and he, like, looks at me. You know, didn't didn't... Hey, you know, kinda like raises brow a little bit, didn't say anything and goes,

Is that really what you wanna do? And I said, yeah.

That's really what I wanna do And he's like,

you should do it. I'm gonna support you one hundred percent.

And and he... And he's... Any in dude he's never gone back on that. He's spent any time

He's one of those guys that, like, if I ever need anything, he's a call away always. Yeah. Here. Whether whether it's advice or it's just... I mean, his...

He's he's an incredible person in my life, and I I

treasure our relationship. It's it's been awesome. So...

So

so you...

You get the blessing of the shorts to.

Yeah. So... Yeah. And then and then then it was game on, You know? And then I moved back to sonoma,

and I was working at a rep... I still work part time at a restaurant here in in Glen. Yeah.

And

I was was cooking

got my captain license, and then I had that conversation with the chef, and I was like, look,

on I need to go part time

in some in some capacity, so I can pursue this

because it was it was always, like, you know, I'd go on my weekend

for being in the kitchen and I'd come back,

like, on Monday,

and I'd be all summer, you know, and they're, like, where'd did you fish this weekend? And Have, like, Burnt out, you know, because I've had been fixing for, like, two days straight? Yeah.

It was just, you know, every once in a while, I'd bring fishing and for staff meal or something like that. Yeah. They they they always kinda knew. That's where my heart was. Yeah. For. And

so so that was another fortunate

circumstance

where I was given...

I was given an opportunity to work to still help with the restaurant and but have time to to dedicate to starting my business. And

so that's basically what I'm been doing since.

That's

that's such a... That's

that's such a unique path. Right? Like, there's... I don't there's no one else thing.

I mean, like I said, when we started this, like,

the list of places on your website you fish. Like, I had to look them up on a map. So, like, it's not like you're, like,

you you're not following the traditional path, and that's...

So Yeah. When you start doing this stuff, like, well,

I mean, it sounds like you fish the app river a little bit, but it was like,

you know, whether it's Lake Be or the app or river. I mean, you talk about Lake Mend casino? I even know where that is. Like Lake Mend casino.

Yeah. All this stuff. Like, did you just start going out on your days off and be like, these are close, you know, draw a circle around your house an hour and be like, okay, I'm guiding in this circle

or we're

Okay.

Well, I mean, like, the way I looked at it was...

I looked at ever... I looked at... Everyone else who was doing

doing the same type of thing. Right? I looked at

all the guys in Tulsa.

Mainly, you know, bryce bryce,

what are My really good buddies. And

and Mike Cost, You know, Yeah. I looked at those guys, and I was like, Oh, like, alright. So they focus,

you know,

almost their entire year just doing stripe. In a perfect world, that's that's where I started. You know, I just discussed all I wanted to do is fisher stripe. And then,

the reality of it was

you can't do that, especially here, especially on an apple. And

you know, the late thing came about,

and

that grade

that was awesome that filled up the rest of that year, basically,

Yeah. But

you know, there's always that option of of the of Pew Creek. And,

you know, back

object in the... Right. Right. Right. The all

room. Yeah.

And, like, back then

back then, there was a guy

Greg Sc who used to work at sweeney. Oh keywords.

Every every time I went into Sweeney,

like, to get stuff, like, tying and stuff for flowers Yeah. Yeah like you need to stay off fishing for those fish with stripes man.

I like, Greg. Like Yeah. It's alright. It's alright. Like... Greg was actually really good friends with Ryan Johnston.

And Oh, wasn't. Yeah. I wanna say,

Greg's now, like a sheriff for something up north, like, up in Oregon Washington...

It's in Oregon. Yeah. From what I heard. Yeah. Yeah.

That's a blow cast.

So he was, like, he was always omni about throwing computer, you know? Because all those sweeney guys, you know, Ryan used to work at Sw. Ryan Williams.

I... You know, I and I think that's how Ryan Johnston met Ryan Williams.

Was john connection. I think because Johnson was down at Davis for a number of years, and that's... I remember Ryan Williams coming up,

like, around the time Ryan was at Davis getting out of Davis. So I I yeah. I had... Yeah. That made did not know that Williams worked at Sweeney. I didn't know that. That's a new connection. Yep. Yeah. And used to fish the river too. Oh, okay. Okay. Yeah. So

So anyway, so he was...

He was always on to Fish pew. And back then, you know, there was still probably

five guides,

four to five guides working computer, and they They were all

they were all busy too. Because like you said,

just its location. Yeah. There was like a heyday. I mean, there was... Mean, I remember when Toby had to shop down there. Like, that was the place. Like, that... I mean,

those big brown trout swam up that thing from one of the lakes or... I mean, I'm by no means in actually up. But it I remember it was much more of a a thing,

you know? Right. Right. Whereas I think nowadays,

you know, I don't

completely know

exactly what's going on up there, but I have friends that that fish it regularly. And from what I hear,

it's busier than ever.

And I know, that's good. Right? Like I mean, maybe.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. But, you know, for me,

you know, if I'm gonna go fish,

you know, if I have a day off, and I'm gonna go fish,

There's comfort in me knowing that I can turn the key on my boat

and get away from people. I mean, whether whether I'm gonna catch this or not. I I generally like to get away from people. Absolutely That's not... That's not because I don't like people. It's just... I like the t it of fishing. I think that's part of it. You know? Absolutely.

And that was a big thing. You know, when I was working in kitchens, you know, you work long hours and,

I got pretty burnt out

you know, physically and mentally, But, like, fishing was, like, my way to

recharge, you know, recharge the batteries. And, you know, I I still have I still have that same

same mindset, and... Yeah.

You know, getting in

getting in Waiters early in the morning

to get into a hole before

everyone shows up isn't

necessarily my

No. Idea fun. But but then again, it's just... It's, you know, for a lot of people. That's that's why fishing. And Well, that that's. That's the option that's available to them. You know what I mean? Right. Right. And that's again, that goes all the way back to, like,

one of the reasons that I was really interested in talking to you was because

you did something,

you went some place and are going places that people don't go. And that's a tough road, man. Like, because you gotta

you gotta convince people to come to these places that they've never heard of. You know what I mean? Like? Totally. Totally. I know Barry from the bass world is one of the best ba fisheries

west of the Mississippi if not in the country, but

If you ask any fly fisherman, what do they know about Lake Berry they'll be like, what? Well isn't Put Creek run out of that thing? You know, like,

yeah. Yeah. I mean, and and look, and I consider myself fairly hip to the bass scene. I'm like, where are the hell Lake men Oh, my gosh. And I even put notes on here. I'm like, north of Clear lake. I'm like, Yeah. Did not Know that was up there.

So

talk about talk about a couple of the... Like, Barry, I've you know, through Ryan Williams, I've learned a lot about Barr and and, you know, Ryan's ventures down to Clear lake and Barr,

you know Yeah. I remember, Ryan asking me... Well, one of my really dear friends for over twenty years

you know, John Sherman is...

He's talked about clear like, forever. And if you're in involved in bass fishing, everyone knows Clear like. But

he said something to me one time and I related it to Ryan and and and Ryan took this in Ran is Sc said, you know, that one of the few places that

fly fishing has not gone yet in our state was

clear like a Mary

in that. Right. Those are very fly friendly lakes.

That literally no one is guiding or fishing. And I I totally sleep to this day, like, if someone asked me, like, who guides Bury and clearly, could be, like, Patrick and Ryan. Like, that's it. Yep. So

tell me a little bit about those lakes because... I'm sure you do some stuff on clear, Like, but Barry, what Ryan's told me and what I've learned about it. It it

it it is one almost perfectly geared for fly fishing to some degree.

Yeah. You know, Barr is a big lake.

It...

I don't think it's quite as big as clear lake. I've only been to clear, like, a couple times I never fish grows just boat.

But, you know, Ryan spends a lot of time on Clear lake. Yeah.

For

in in my experience, Marriott is a huge lake. It's got

it's got everything. Right? Yeah. It's it's got

it got shallow,

shallow weed areas, you know, a lot of really good bedding areas on the north end of the lake.

There's multiple different arms,

you know, creek arms that come off of it, Yeah. There's

steep rocky structure, good float and fly walls.

There's a lot of... There's a lot of like, high spots and islands, depending on where the water levels at.

You know, you can fish, you can fish these kind of, like, red clay,

island type areas,

which is cool. You know, it's good pop water, good good streamer water.

It it it's really... It just depends

really depends how you wanna catch them, you know, and and what the time of the year it is. But,

for the most part,

for the most part, I'm doing the Ba thing up there.

In May, you can get... You can get some pretty good days on top water. But

for the most for the most part, we're doing we're doing Bob thing. And

I know I know John got a huge small amount.

Small mouth or a large mouth a couple years ago up up and barely Yes. I mean, thing was a freaking tank. Yeah. I so that's picture of it. There's... I mean catch

large mouths, small mouths spotted back. You can catch them all in there. Right? First of all, it's got all the all the species of fish.

Right. Right. It it it it... It's got all three... They've got it's got trout. It's got carp. It's got all the pan fish. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, everything's there, you know, it's like... So cool. There's... Yeah. And and, you know, the amount of bait, everything,

what me and Ryan figured out was

everything in the lake, especially during the spawn,

kind of revolves around

the bait fish and what they're doing. Yes. So

it's it's funny because, you know, we've

we've noticed in the in the springtime time, you'll you'll see...

You know, you'll be fishing

and you'll literally see a cloud of thread chad come around the boat. And it's just like being in the bay and seen a huge cloud of anchovies. And that's like when I heard those guys talk about Barry, it was

it's bait fishing in the spring. Like, you could go into a cove. It literally looks like baja or something.

You know, Like... Dude exactly. And what's what's really cool up area is the water clarity. Yes. Yes. It's

Dude, if if you don't get one of those

one of those really heavy winners. Yeah. It it it can be

fifteen to twenty feet of visibility

by

the end of April. And that that is so insane for California reservoirs. Like, I can't think of a red where you get that kind of... I mean, maybe Tahoe on, like, of gorgeous day. You know what I mean? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, but it's it's a different. It's funny because, you know, Tahoe,

Tahoe is that it's that blue kind of marine.

Kinda. Yeah.

Exactly. Whereas, like, Barry is more... You know, when Barry gets choppy just like any other, like, Yeah. You know, it's a huge voting, like, But, when it's clear,

it is... It's really cool to see.

We'll have to get you up at some point next spring here. Oh, yeah. I I I it. One of those lakes that it's, like, I've even... I remember, you know, when John was talking about that and I'm, like, I even, like, calculated the miles out to Clear lake once and Bury. And I was like, man. That's just a little too far from my home. But

Yeah. It

as Barry... You know, it's like,

I think clearly had that big fish kill a few years ago, and it was, like, kind of the eyes of the conventional bass world kinda turned off Clear lake, and guys started to figure out Barry,

you know, like, Right. I think Right. That was.

Billy Hines is out there and a bunch of pros, Fl guys are out there, and and

you started listening and kinda paying attention to that, and it was like, this sounds like an amazing place. You know, it was just like kind of enough under the radar, You know?

Yep. And and, you know, what happened was when

clear,

stopped fishing as well as it did back in the nineties Yeah. A lot of those guys can clear, lake started coming down and... Gotcha.

Essentially took up residency at Barr because, you know, for them, it's not that far. No. Like, I was looking on the map this morning, and it's, like, they're right there.

Right. Right. Yeah. Right. You know. So for them, it's it's, you know, it's

for

world class

fast fishing less than an hour from them is, like, it's a no brainer. So, you know, what we're seeing is we're seeing so many people from Lake County now.

So many people from the South Bay. You get a lot of people from up from the South Bay. Gotcha.

Because I'm not sure what they have down there in the South Bay as far as as far as lakes go. But I got are going south from there. Know what I mean? You'd probably go down that fresno snow, you know, that area.

Sure. Sure. Yeah.

So so, you know, Barry is Barry is an incredible place.

What, like, all the lakes this year, I didn't get to spend much time on any of them because they were closed, but... Yeah. Yeah.

But I'm looking forward to to next spring for sure when... So

how does that kinda bracket in your season? So, you know, you you you're you're kinda... So your bread and butter the nap sounds like your stuff, but what is what does your season look like?

Yeah. So

like I said yesterday,

I just did my last trip

up on Lake sonoma. So I'm done with the lakes

around

second, or third week in July is when I start

scouting the Napa, kinda three fishing.

Yeah. And did July I'll start start booking trips, and then I'll be on the Napa all the way through Christmas.

Oh, gotcha. So e... Good six months. Yeah. Yep. Gotcha. So so we get

with our proximity to San Francisco Bay,

we get groups of fish that come in and out of the system on a single tide. Gotcha. So

we have resident fish, you know, probably, like, your rivers up there to Logan. Yeah. Where you guys have have resident fish. Yeah.

Kinda year round, you know, but they're usually smaller, whatnot. But

you can go out on any given week and bump into a school of fish that came in

that that morning, you know, or the night before, and they're there checking it out,

hanging in eating whatever they're doing. And then you can go out the next day and they can be

all the way up in town,

downtown not where they can be back out in the bay. It's Gotcha. It's it's that

it's it's that transient of a situation. Right? Oh, so it's it's an... I mean, that sounds incredibly challenging. But I would imagine once you figure it out, you figure it out because it's pattern. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So from so for me,

it's it's

advantageous for me to be

out there from now until

August and September one,

quote on, unquote, our fall round starts. Gotcha. You know. Oh, gotcha. Because we can have some... We can have some really incredible issue. So then the lakes just bracket that in, like, by the time that... Yeah. And then you're right back into the lakes in the December, January, February, March April thing, ma'am. That's... Right. Yeah. I usually I usually take

better part of January off.

To usually do some seal head fishing with Joshua,

I'll try to get I'll try to get up to pyramid,

freeze freeze my ass off. Yeah for a couple days. And

and then,

And then, you know, February...

You know what's interesting

Hogan

about our lakes

for

blake and Sim in North Bay. Yeah. Is it is it we don't have...

We don't have

the

December in January

like you guys do. Like at Or bill and Yeah. Some of those other foot.

In somebody... And I forget who was, but somebody explained to me something about.

Those Thread s don't behave, like, the walk of soggy min that we have,

Right. Which makes December and January tough.

And totally. I I I couldn't tell you what it was that they explained to me, but

when I I remember somebody telling me that.

Yeah. Yeah. And and that's it because I'll I'll go out. Oh, let's get really anxious, you know, But yeah ended did January. The card I'm ready. I'm ready. Yeah. Go up.

When don't catch any fish and then on, you know, first person I call is Ryan. I'm like, Ryan. What's going on? What's going on? It's not fit org goes. He's like slamming them. Yeah. He's just

smashing him. And then it happens have happens every year and I'm like,

And then I wait, you know, second week in February, it starts happening. And then it slowly starts ramping up. Yeah. March

full on April,

amazing. And then May,

you can either go

you can keep going barber,

or you can go top water. May

up here,

Barr yes Lake Sonoma Lake Min casino is a great month for top water.

And that's when I've heard of those guys. I forget. I think it was one of my friends told me, you know, you go into a cove. And like I said, it looks like Baja. They're busting bait, and you're just running done. And that I remember very specifically that it was the month of May. So... Totally. And and, you know, the... Frustrating thing about that situation

is when you find it, it's super cool, and the fish are always there. They're on the bay balls. Right? Yeah. Find them. Just like any p palazzo situation,

but those vape balls are constantly moving. Oh, dude. You're... I I I... I you... I would buy no means

think that that would be an easy or

Oh, stress our game to play, you know? Oh, dude... It's a it's just like being on a flat in San Francisco bay, and keen fish working. Yeah. I get all fired up. Right? And you get one or two shots. Either you guys can get it done, or

you gotta find another flat some more fish working because

you know, but it's just... It's sometimes

depending on the water tents, those bait balls

will move slower and will move faster, or you can kinda see which direction they're gonna move because there's huge, man. Like,

Like, when you see them, it's it's really incredible. I've never seen it on Lake Sonoma, Like, Mean, you know, it's really something that's unique to barry as.

Gotcha. Which I... Which I think is really cool. Right? That's like another one of those things area. So one of those places that's just it sound like anything else. Yeah.

Yeah. So you talked... You you kinda talked about the bay a little bit and before we hit record you were talking about your new boat and we're were kinda talking about that. Are you... Are you gonna be spending more time out in the bay? Is that something? Because I... You know,

when I was looking at the map, I didn't realize how close you are to the bay. You know? Yeah. I'm I'm thirty five minutes from

the launch in Santa fe.

Wow So

when

you know, that was...

That was kind of when I started this whole thing, you know, the nap the nap is my backyard.

Yeah. But if if you push fifteen miles past that.

That's the bay. So if that's, you know, I I... Would I consider the napa up, it's more it's more part of the bay than it is part of the delta.

Yeah. And and I would... I noticed that on the map, you know?

And it and that's that's a product of proximity

and sal solidity rather than

rather than just grouping Napa into the Delta because you can do that and everyone tends to do that. You know, when I talked to people and they're, like, well where are you...

So it's like, well, yes and no. Right?

I'm not technically in the bay, but we're the first tri

off of San Pablo Bay, San Francisco Bay.

On the way up for the delta. So when those fish...

When those fish leave San Francisco Bay Hogan. Yeah. And they and when they go up they... You know, they follow the

main shipping channel up into Car straight and they start heading your way. Yeah. We're they're we're they're first left. Right? Yeah. You like go.

Oh, alright. Alright. Cool. Ready to move. Yeah.

First left they take, boom.

They're on our backyard.

So

that's...

You know, I always tell people. It's, you know, it's the same game. Right? It's stripe fishing, but Totally it's it's more it's much more akin to fishing San Francisco Bay than it is fishing the delta. And that's so cool because most people...

I mean,

I've been a stripe fisherman for a long time, and I've never fished the bay, You know, but that is kinda where it all started. So it's like, that's cool. Right.

Right. And and, you know, that kinda goes back to my roots because, like, you know we did a lot of same fishing and how the fishing

grown up and... Yeah.

You know, when you catch

when you catch a saltwater fish,

in salt,

there's something different about it. Like, you know, Stripe stripe are scrappy little dudes to begin. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah Yeah. But with... But when they're when they're in their element,

there's is

There's nothing like it. I...

Yeah. I. And that's that's, you know what? Like, a lot of people have told me that I I was... I think I was talking to George Rave and was asking about officially pay. And he's like,

You know, I'm like, all the fish you see. They're all about the same size. You know, they're all about that. Like, Yeah. Just Yeah. Just like, almost exactly cookie cutter. He's like, did those fish rip though. He's like, they will. Show you on a nine weight. I'm like, wow. That's awesome. You know, I'm like, It totally makes sense, man. I mean, there you

you gotta be a little hyped up. You your adrenaline gotta be a little little higher level to survive in the salt, you know, when you're out there. You can kinda let your guard down a little bit in the river or something, but out there go

Keyed up.

Dude do you know it's funny, you know, it's funny, Hogan is, like, when they're out there,

they're just they're just

trying to survive. Oh, yeah. They're just trying to survive as as a stripe where it's, like, when they come into the river,

Like,

aside from us, who's gonna get them. They're tall dogs. Yeah. Especially the adults bro. That's the adults. Yeah. They come in and they're like, dude. This is... Know, like, they like eighth grade Yeah. It's like, going from eighth grade to your freshman you're a high. You know, you go

ruin the school to just be in the guy that's gonna get thrown in the trash can. You know? Totally. Totally. Yeah. Totally.

So, you know, there's a there's a there's a sense of urgency out there in the bay for sure and you can tell.

Mh. You can just tell by the way those fish act. Yeah. You know, they're...

They move they move around quickly and they stay together,

which is,

you know, two key elements for surviving

and in an independent like that. So Yeah. So when is that season? When when are you when are you out in the bay?

So, you know, it

it can be a little bit spotty

and

in July. Yeah. June, you know,

June, June can be decent. July can be pretty good. Mh. And then once you get into August and September, that's... Those are your main. Gotcha. Those your main heavy hitting months. Right now, you know, from what I understand,

guys get them on the beaches this time of year. You know, we'll get him at S. We'll get him in monterey. We'll we'll get him at Dillon. We'll get him at point reyes.

I haven't done a lot of that

that

phishing Yeah thing.

I know there's a guy down.

I believe his name is

Evan Evan.

Yeah. P the only one that I know that does... I mean, I got a couple clients that do that, but, like...

Sure. Evan Z only guy I know that guides it. Yeah.

Right. And I think right now, Hogan is kind of when they

actually see those adults. Gotcha. You know, they'll they'll see them on the beaches in the summertime like this. But, once you start getting into August and September, all those fish that we're out,

running the coast are coming back into the bay. Gotcha So Gotcha. They'll they'll come in in, you know, different schools will come in and we'll stage in different areas and

you kinda have, you know, a month and a half to almost two months of

playing with those fish. And at the same time, too, we're getting

we're getting fish

pushing into Napa too. So I'm kinda

juggling between the two. Right? Gotcha, know I'm just kinda going where they're at. You know Yeah. And and, you know, the base the bay a lot more finicky,

weather wise, weather and tide wise.

You really have

probably

ten to twelve

good tied days a month that you really wanna be out there. K. And then... But what's nice is, like, the rest of those days out of those months, I can

Can fish napa because it's a little bit less

finicky as far as tied and tied and wet go. That's a great program, man. I'm not lie. Yeah. That's that's

you know, it's close to home. You're not spending all day on the road, tone a boat, and

you know, you... You're in a boat. You're not rowing.

It's a great program. Yep. Yes. Yeah. Schwartz.

Right there in line with Shorts. Man. Like, Yeah. I know. He's got a pretty good program himself. So...

Yeah. For sure. And, you know, because, like, for me,

I just needed... You know, I looked at all you guys,

you know, I looked at you and shocked and

everyone who is doing the same thing. And I was like, does this industry need another dive that's literally doing the same exact thing.

As guys... Has guys who have been doing it you know, fifteen, twenty plus years.

Yeah. And I I... You know, I had an honest conversation with myself and said, probably not.

But

there's fisheries... There's untouched fisheries.

That are closer

to San Francisco

than,

you know, say your guys is. Oh, absolutely absolutely that you work. So absolutely. And I mean, I was thinking about that when I was kinda making my notes for and stuff, and I'm like,

how many guys drive three hours to fish with me that have never driven thirty to fish with Patrick.

You know what I mean? Like, that? Like, or not even fish with Patrick, actually, like, know that there is fishing.

Between Right. You know?

So...

Yeah. I I... Yeah.

So, you know, that's a that's a big thing for me. It's just kind of,

you know, people that are

passionate about fly fishing in the bay. It's it's nice to

show them what's available to them. You know, if they don't have the time or these days have the

confidence of going

three or four hours from their house, you know, to fish, There's there's options here.

Oh Yeah being able to being able to showcase that and

show people what they have in their backyard is is,

you know, why I got into it? Because

I'm I'm just really passionate about the area and the officially and

Oh, well, it it truly is a little, you know, I I mean, in in interesting to the,

I guess just to the the credit of those places,

in the fly fishing world, they're not well known.

But from the fishing world, the conventional fishing world,

these are all incredibly well known places. It's the fly fishing world's fault for not realizing that they're that... You know what I mean It's... You know, Yeah. Totally. You know, you you talk about the Napa River and Bury and all this stuff and, like, you're talking about, you know,

a movie that came out thirty years ago in the, you know, the fishing. That's not longer and the fly fishing. They're like, well, I haven't Haven't heard of that. I haven't seen that one. You know, it's So Yeah. It's us definitely missing the boat on that stuff. So Totally. Totally. And and and, you know, it's people,

you know, it's people, like, Greg Hall and houston been... He's been guiding the gutted in bay here,

probably for the west four or five years at least, you know, he's been fishing dave's his whole life,

and, you know, he's been one of those kind of pioneers. Him and George have been

really pushing

fishing locally. Right? We have so... We have... Especially nowadays with

with, you know, now that techs got into San Francisco. There's so many people, and so many people are age Hogan, you know, that are

that

are into fly fishing, but they a don't have a lot of time to go on these trips or b

right now, just don't feel comfortable with everything going on, and, you know, Craig

and George over at Lost Coast. They've just been huge for proponents of

of, you know, fishing locally in our areas and,

Yeah. And I've I've actually had really it. Yeah. I've had that conversation with George and was one of those things when I had it. I'm just, like, that

that is genius in the sense of, like, it's one of those things that when George said, he's like, you know, look, I I want people to locally. I want people that travel to San Francisco

do have a place that they can fish while they're here

because, you know, so many people come to San Francisco for business.

And Right. You know, could stay over a day and fish.

You know, it's like, Right. One of those... It was one of those statements or kinda of conversations. I remember a few years ago, I had with him where I was, like, that... That's so simple and such common sen logic.

Yeah. Like, how did how did every other person in the fly fishing industry that's ever existed in San Francisco overlook that?

You know, like... Yeah. How did everyone else miss that pitch? And Yeah. It's one of those things that's right in front of your nose. Right? Yeah. Exactly to see when it's right in front of your nose? That's a great way to put because that's exactly It's like, you know, I I look at these pictures of people catching fish at the

Chrissy field? I'm like, how how did no one do that until, like, three years ago.

Know what I mean, like, how did that go miss

by the You know, Man, the

those lost coast guys have some great pictures in front of the bridge there at fort Right. Yeah. It it's dude it's it's so cool too because, you know, I've taken, like, this last year and a half. I've kind of step back a little bit from social media. Yeah.

I was never on Facebook, but

my Instagram was... I just... I... You know, the thing about Instagram is I never really knew how to use it, like correctly. Yeah. Do you know, like, the...

I'm not gonna lie I had to learn. You know I yeah. Had to that help.

And, like, the only reason that I even had it was to just follow people like you and chuck and Mike and Bryce and, like, see what everyone's doing,

you know? Because it's it's basically...

I remember, like, I'd be laying in bed. My, girlfriend would look over and I'd be scrolling through my Instagram, and she's, like,

it's... She's like, your Instagram is basically just fish corn.

Totally. And I'm like, totally. And I'm like, yeah. That's why I have it.

And and and

that's why I. So I get so I do you know what everything's up to. And so I kinda picked the last year and a half off, and I haven't I haven't been on it. And...

But also get pictures, like, people send me pictures of people like Christian field

you know, it hal it or Stripe, and it's like, Yeah. They've done... While George, they have done such a great job at just promoting that, and,

you know, we've got so many people that come here on business and, Absolutely. But for pleasure just to see the city or wherever, and, you know, that's a pretty iconic

shot. You know, if you get... If you're standing in the surf

holding a fish and

the Golden Gate bridges in the background, that's I mean... Oh, dude. Like, Wanna I want that shot for my wall. Like, I I yeah dude. The only thing, like, I was funny. I start seeing some of these shots and I'm, like, is there something out of frame that I'm missing? Is there, like, you know, some homeless en camp? With, like, dudes, like, shooting up in the background that, like, isn't being shown.

And I drove and then I was in the city.

I think last spring I went down there and did some stuff with my family and stopped at Georgia shop and then some stuff there and actually drove by Chrissy Field and I'm like,

This is like a nice place. Like, this is not bad. You know, this is... Oh, like how did this? You know? And then the whole fish for stripe in the bay

and then up where you are... It's it's just...

You know, it's such a great place because it's such a good desk a nation. I mean, I can't imagine right.

You know, all the stuff there is to do for spouses or people that may not necessarily beef life for fishermen around you, while, you know, maybe Brad or somebody goes efficient. Like, it is.

It's such a smart kinda play because there places that people already go for other things, and you're just creating different activity there while they're there. You know? Right. So... And and and what works

in my benefit

is that

in our area,

the wine business is just the huge

economic factor. Right? Yeah. And

my my stripe season

pretty much coincides with crush Yeah. And harvest and everything. So on a typical year, this not obviously being a typical year, but usually, we've got so many people coming in just to be in the valley during that time, because it's a special time. Right? Yeah. Little.

When when they're when they're picking grapes and when they're

crushing and they're making wine and they're mixing

the same time. It's, like, we've got stripe around and we're fly fishing for stripe, and it's you know, I get so many clients that come in,

you know, and and the wife goes and

wines and dimes and goes to the wine and does their thing and

as gets the fish. I for the business point of everyone's happy you. Yeah. You're sitting on it. I mean, that's great. Like, I get people that are, like, where we're fish well, butte city. It's like. There's not much to do for the ladies in butte city, you know,

you know, god bless willow, but you know? Yeah.

Yep. Yep. But it's like, but, you know, then, again, you've got a different kind of client clientele tell, you know, some people. Absolutely.

Some some people are gonna bypass me because it's too close to home. They're like, you I'm going. And I wanna, like,

go fishing. I wanna get... I wanna get away from all this. And, you know, that's one that's the flip side of that coin that Totally you know, Told we're right in the middle of it and

you know, I mean, I'll I'll definitely tell you there's there's some places

where we fish in Napa that you know that you're

in Napa right. Right totally totally. Yeah. Yeah I there's no, you know, We've got we've got the same things

Know. Got a homeless

issue up here, everyone's dealing with it, You know? Oh, yeah. Regardless. That's really But Any water way that throws flows through humanity.

Right. Right. So Right. They're gonna be there, You know? But

but, you know, that's that whole other... That's the flip side of that coin. Is that, you know. Yeah. Because, like, you know, when I get...

Me and me and Bryce,

me and Bryce actually have a day with

with chuck next Yeah. Yeah. That's a in August. Chuck In August. Yes. Yes. That's funny because Yeah chuck emailed me or messaged me and he's like,

because we we we guard our officially. Like, you do too as well And Right. Bryce usually comes... I think Bryce comes up and fishing with Chuck every summer with

a client or something, you know,

I Always make sure to know because it's, like,

that stretch wherever they go. There's a bunch of different stretches. It's like, I'm like, okay. Why Ain't going there for, like, a week. Because just got after you come through. Well, like, after chuck comes through with, like, two sticks, like bryce in the bed. It's like, yeah. That place just got nuke. You know,

so

so he's like, who's who's just Patrick guy I'm like, oh, man you have a ton of funny super cool bring him, but definitely let me go where you take him in Bryce because I ain't going there for like, know, least a week.

Yeah. And it's, like... And and it's, like, me and Bryce have been looking forward to it so much. You know, because we

we kind of we fish we fish as much as we can together, you know, where you're pushing the bay or or the delta or whatever, but, like, rush.

For us. Dude... There's so much value in it because, like, we're, like, going fishing for a day. We're, like, going some place, like,

price has been up there before, but, like, I haven't been up there before. I've never seen it. Oh, yeah. Like, for me, that's, like, that's, like, getting out of of town. Totally Like a big deal. You know? I mean, I'm Yeah. I'm I'm, like, I'm so stoked for that for that day in August. It's like me go to the delta or something. Like, I I know yeah. I mean, I know. It turns into, like, a big deal. Right? Oh dude a super big deal. Like... Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

No. I... Anytime I'm going fishing, and I'm, like, looking back and, like, my boats. Not attached to my truck. I'm just like, this is awesome. I'm going fishing. Like... So, yeah. Man. You guys have a good time too, man. There's a, there's a lot of big fish around this year. It's it's a good year. You guys

you know, I think Bryce has had some pretty incredible days up here with Chuck. So, you know, I can't imagine any different.

I'm just so sufficient the guy to be honest. Like, no I'm, you know, I... I met him that that one day we're

pleasant him that we talked about earlier and I, you know, I I've seen him at meetings and stuff like that. And he's just he just seems like the kind of guy that you just... You'd wanna go fishing with, You know? Oh, yeah. Dude He is he is

You know, he's a true southern gentleman. He's probably my, you know, best friend in the whole wide world, and he he he is...

There is no dude that I have ever been around that has

picked up guiding as quick as him.

Like, Right. And and It was probably a natural the natural thing for right. Just... It, you know, he came from that,

that kinda saltwater

fishing in Florida, and it just everything out here just made sense, I think. You right. It just.

Fishy fishy guy. Hey, I just wanna thank everybody for tuning in a today and thank my guess, Patrick Mckenzie. We will be back next time.

Stay tuned and stay ready for that

naming contest. I think

me and Chad may get that together eventually. I'm not sure, but definitely eventually.

Alright. Be well, everyone.

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